Gotta keep it vague for privacy but the key details should be enough. We first met through a dating app. It didn’t work out. We remained friends. Became best friends. They fell on terribly hard times. They moved in with me. Sleeping on the couch was not good for the long term. We now share a bed, and eventually went halvesies on a new bigger one. We became very close over the past few years. I love my best friend. Sometimes do non intercourse sexish things but have no interest in a relationship. Hard times are likely to continue due to external problems that despite our best efforts, will not likely go away. I’d never kick them out, it would be on the level of hurting a puppy. What kind of monster would do that? I have been wanting a relationship but it would be awkward to have to explain all this to any new partners. I can’t even imagine how my friend would take it. I wouldn’t want to sacrifice our relationship just so I can start dating again. A room in the apartment is vacant now and they could move into that one but I dread broaching the topic to them. I don’t know how they’re going to react and no matter what happens I want to keep this person in my life. We’re getting older and there’s no guarantee that the “hard times” will go away. It might even last the rest of our lives. I don’t know what to do. I can’t face the reality that they might leave rather than watch me do my own thing. How do I have my cake and eat it too?
What in the world? You are in a relationship with them. You can’t live with, sleep in the same bed with, be best friends with, and do sexual stuff with someone and not be in a relationship! What do you think a relationship is?!
You say you don’t want a relationship with them but what on Earth would you change if you entered into a “relationship” with them? Just your perspective and a label from the sounds of it.
I feel as though you need to reassess where you’re actually at in this. Think about what a relationship means to you and why this person cannot fit that role for you.
And above all, you need to talk to them about this and ask if they think you’re in a relationship. Because you might need to “break up” with them regardless of how you feel about it
Yeah, best friend? What the hell, i wish i had that kinda relations with my best friends…
As the old saying goes: “BROJOB! BROJOB! CHOOCHOO!”
Don’t let your dreams be dreams
Had a “relationship” like this with my ex. Lots of “sexish” things, dates, furniture building together, inside jokes to denote “drop everything, it’s cuddle time”. First week we met after a long time of no-contact (we dated, broke it up, then she reached out after a few years and we started working together) we locked so hard in deep conversation, that we almost burned the house down (we left a pot of boiling soup on the stove; then remembered about it a few times and conciously decided not to check it because we were feeling so great talking). We thought “oh we are just talking for 10 mins, it’s fineeee” when that shit went on for hours.
Yet it “wasn’t a relationship” after it fell apart. That shit ruins a person. I basically felt gaslit hard, questioning my sanity, the choices I made. Still trying to recover really
Have you asked them if they would want that? Serious question.
Edit: sometimes I think we are too shy when it comes to telling our friends about our feelings and wishes and too judgemental when they tell us theirs. Why does knowing something intimate about each other have to be awkward? I’d rather have them tell me something I don’t want to fulfill than find out after 20 years that there’s something we both wanted and never talked about.
Reassess is one of those words that just doesn’t in my brain sometimes.
That’s all I have to say, carry on.
This is already a relationship. A non-sexual one, but still. Even a very strong one.
In a relationship, when the two are on such different levels (as indicated somewhat as “hard times”), then a crisis is unavoidable, sooner or later.
You want to do your own thing. That is very OK and normal. Just be prepared that the way out is going to hurt, for a while.
I’ve been avoiding it because it will probably hurt us both but reading through these responses I am beginning to see that you’re right. Thanks for responding.
I can’t even imagine how my friend would take it.
OK, OK, time out. You haven’t tried talking with them about it? If you have as strong a mutual (platonic(ish?)) relationship with them as you say you do, then it should be able to survive a serious conversation about your shared future, especially if you emphasize that you want to try to keep them in your life in a major way like this.
That conversation will probably be hard, and I really can’t think of a solution that would feel perfect if I were in your shoes, but I would sure as hell rather have that conversation than the “I made a decision, and here is how you will be impacted” one, or the “I kept my life on hold because I was worried how you might react to talking about it” one.
I don’t know your personality or your friend’s personality, so I can’t promise that you will sort it all out without emotions running high, or what the ultimate outcome of such a conversation will be.
But jeez, bud, you’ve GOT to be able to have serious talks with people whom you trust and care about.
I guess I am a bit of a coward. I do appreciate the comment. It’s a good point.
I can just confirm that. I was a coward once (see my other comment) and it made me miserable and cost me a 7 year relationship. I don’t exactly know if having the talk earlier would have saved the relationship but it would definitely have made the breakup less ugly.
You seem like a caring person, so perhaps this will help guide decision-making. When you make major decisions that deeply impact another person, or even just get real far in evaluating options and imagining outcomes, asking strangers, etc…when you do these things without communicating with the other person at all, the end result is you protecting yourself, not them. Even if it feels like you’re carefully considering their interests.
No matter your intentions, if you’re not communicating with them and letting them participate in big decisions that affect you both, you are not acting in their best interests. There are many times (like abuse) when that is 100% the right approach, but you need to be very clear eyed about that choice to remove the other person’s agency. The way you’re going about this protects you at their expense, and in this situation it sounds kind of cruel, rather than justified. I’m not judging you harshly, your intentions seem good, but you need to understand that this is not a loving way to treat an adult.
Your cowardice is likely the result of psychological trauma.
You need to think of this as an opportunity to heal some trauma, using this situation as the path into that healing.
My advice is get a good therapist. Preferably one who’s been practicing since the 1990s or earlier.
Can’t have your cake and eat it too, you can choose one or the other, but if you pretend that both are possible you might hurt and get hurt.
It sucks but I don’t think there is a way for your current relationship (since it is one) to remain pleasent while going for another
Also, maybe have a talk with your friend, figure out what you are to eachother
You tell your best friend what you need and they will either understand or take a different path in life.
It’s quite simple really.
Yep. If you communicate respectfully, they aren’t your best friend if they don’t care about your desires / goals.
That doesn’t mean they won’t have hurt feelings or need time to process though.
I’m usually on the “no, that girl who smiled at you because she’s a friendly person didn’t lead you on” side, but you bought a bed together and do sex stuff, even if you haven’t had actual sex…
That doesn’t mean you owe them forever, or even now, but you’re a big part of the reason for their emotions here.
Start by broaching the separate beds, IMO. Then give a little time before dating, if you want to minimize pain.
You don’t
You have lived with diffuse boundaries for some time and are now reaping the penalties. You can and should proceed with care and grace as you implement boundaries and define roles to move to where you want to be but it is absolutely foolish to think that it will not be at least a little hurtful to your pseudo partner.
they will implement their boundaries in response to changes you are proposing; you have to respect these. If they chose to leave and tell you to fuck off then you have learned a valuable lesson in why you shouldn’t let boundaries be so diffuse for so long through so many changing contexts.
It’s not realistic (usually) to expect you to know everything you need and want from a relationship up front but when contexts change you need to clarify what is and is not okay. If you’re okay with keeping it casual after things don’t work out that’s fine but make sure they’re aware. If they suddenly have to move in consider the boundaries of the situation again: are they still cool with keeping it casual? Are they now that you share a bed? Are they now that you’ve purchased a bed together?
If you’re the one that wants it casual and wants the door open for new relationships it’s your responsibility to make sure your partner is aware of where you stand. One could say your friend/partner is foolish for assuming you’ve changed where you stand, and they’d have a valid point, but one could also say that you’ve been very misleading here. Boundaries need to be enforced and they need to be occasionally reviewed as contexts change, otherwise they fade away
All very valid, I think you’ve hit the nail on the head. I just feel terrible and upset about creating this situation. I, perhaps we, did let the lines blur, I don’t blame either one of us for it. Convenience and familiarity dropped our guard. We were there for each other when we needed it but in hindsight it was foolish to let things go past physical barriers or maybe even emotionally without considering the future. At the time they moved in it was supposed to be temporary, I did miss that detail in my post. That’s no longer the case but we never revisited the topic of where things stand. It’s obvious to me now that I must say something. Thanks for your response.
Life is messy and boundaries blur. Boundaries in relationships aren’t static things and can change. Just keep talking and it and it’s will be fine. You might not get exactly what you want but it will be better in the long run
My only advice is to not try to avoid pain here.
Boundaries get blurred when we try to avoid causing short term pain.
You need to accept that this situation will involve pain to change. If you act out a policy of causing no pain, you will be stuck because every path out of this involves pain.
Yeah that’s not going to end well. You’re basically in a relationship.
I feel bad for your friend.
You seem to treat them as an object to serve your emotional needs and have created a situation where they are dependent on you.
They will probably agree to polyamory out of desperation but it will kill them inside, you aren’t doing them a favor.
Don’t you think that’s a bit harsh? OP wrote a single paragraph, that’s not enough for us to know how they interact on a daily basis. Creating the dependency doesn’t seem to have been on purpose. It happened, it created problems, probably for both of them and OP wants to find a solution that hurts their friend as little as possible. I find that highly commendable. Such situations happen, you only notice them when it’s too late and usually there is no good solution. You can’t just stop supporting them because that would cause serious problems for them but you can’t keep silent about your own needs either unless you want things to escalate somewhere down the road.
Now, the polyamory out of desperation thing is a real problem and I know many poly people (including myself) who have at some point suspected that their “original” partner has only accepted this lifestyle to avoid losing them. And let me tell you, finding that answer is hard. If you don’t ask, you might never know. If you ask once, you won’t be sure if they tell the truth or just want to protect your relationship. If you ask too often and they actually are okay with being poly, you may annoy them. The only way to resolve that is to make sure you can openly communicate about anything and everything. All involved parties must be comfortable telling each other about their pain points and be sure that a disagreement will only strengthen instead of weaken the relationship because everyone will try to find a good solution.
You don’t, I’m sorry. It sounds like the only scenario you’d be happy in is if your friend is happy to share you, although from the sounds of your story your friend wouldn’t be happy to share you. Which means one of you wants more in the relationship and haven’t cleared business about it. I would recommend you talk this with them. Maybe it can work between you two or maybe you realise your friend isn’t as dependent on you as you think. If they’re clinging to you but you want to move on please cut those strings, they only become more and more painful with time.
You need therapy to figure out why you’re placing the needs of other people ahead of your own.
Any advice is to hire a competent therapist. If you’re a man, I also advise joining a men’s group.
This kind of compulsion will fuck up your life if you don’t get it figured out.
non-intercourse sex things in bed with your best friend whom you’re keeping around for financial reasons: fuck you got some shit to figure out
Harsh delivery, but I’m inclined to agree.
I’m inclined to agree with the harsh delivery on this one
This reads as ar anxious attachment and underdeveloped boundaries.
Your needs and wants are valid OP. You deserve autonomy in your own life.
Your friend, intentionally or not, seems to be manipulating you and taking advantage, and you seem to be enabling that.
You should discuss having a partner with them, and what that would look like. They should work with you to promote your needs and wants and fulfillment. That’s what friends do.
I don’t see anyone commenting from the perspective of that friend, and what being them might be like after you talk to them.
I am currently friends with someone I used to be in love with, but she did not feel the same way, so while we dated a few months, she eventually told me it wasn’t going anywhere.
That hurt like hell. But the love and respect I felt and feel for her meant that not spewing a bunch of negative feelings her way was my first concern. If your friend is a wonderful person, they will probably think along similar lines, but you can’t let them entirely spare you. Show them you feel with them.
I was probably the saddest I’ve been, learning it wouldn’t work out, and the time after was akward af.
She told me point blank that some of her friends had adviced her to cut me out of her life entirely, that it would be the “kinder” thing to do. Thank the deities she didn’t follow that advice as we both still wanted each other in our lives. And we DID make it work.
Maintaining the relationship was extra difficult for a while. Years. We came to a kind of unspoken agreement that our romantic lives were a taboo between us, but we went through the motions of a frienship even as she felt she was walking on glass with how I was hurting, and me essentially pretending to be ok when I wasn’t.
That doesn’t mean we didn’t enjoy each others company throughout that, but we made an effort to focus on good things. If we went into the complicated stuff, there was a feedback-loop of empathy where she’d feel bad because I was hurting, which would make me feel bad for making her feel bad for something which was in no way her fault… Etc.
A thing we did when meeting, was that she’d ask “are you ok” to which I’d reply, “no, but I’m going to be”. This way we acknowledged it was there, but buried it most of the time because it was the kind of thing that would get worse the more we dwelled on it. So we didn’t.
I spared her any displays of heartache best I could, and she never rubbed her new boyfriend in my face.
Eventually, I came to the realization that I wasn’t in love anymore. That hearing about her going on dates or moving in with her SO, didn’t cause a twinge of misery. Next time we met, I took up the subject of my former infatuation, and we talked through all the things that had been taboo between us, catching up on things we would have talked about, if not for the need to spare each others feelings. From that day, we’ve been easy friends, able to talk about everything again.
She told me that conversation was really important, as she wasn’t going to put in the extra effort forever. Neither was I, but unlike me she had no way of knowing whether she had to keep it up, unless I told her.
This is to say, when you talk to your friend and figure out how your feelings for each other differ, and what you might want from other people, make a plan for how to get to a new normal, and how you want things to work in-between.
My current friendship with this woman is quite different from the friendship I had before I fell for her, but it’s just as stable, if not more so. But the time in-between required a lot of effort, and a couple very honest conversations. In hindsight, I can find a ton of points when we might’ve just stopped meeting. But neither of us wanted to lose the other. Make that VERY clear. We both told each other, many times, and I think that’s why neither of us ever got into the mindset that it would be “kinder” to “let the other go”.
I’m so glad that you posted this. I had a similar experience. My personal goal is to ask some things only twice, and then suck it up and move on.
The girl I dated in high school broke up with me when college started. A few years later, we were talking again, and we were in the friendship fog. I asked her out again, she said no. That also hurt like hell, but I told myself I’ve asked twice. Time to move on.
I actually recently found a journal entry from that night - “It feels like I am king of the friend zone with her, but holy shit it feels so good to have that cleared up, and now I know I have a solid friend who I don’t have to worry about dating potential”.
After that she was the first female friend who I didn’t constantly have a thought of “…but what if?”, and that was incredible.
Over 10 years later, she’s like a sister to me - she was my best ma’am at my wedding, and I was a bridesman at hers. (my wife likes to poke fun at the imbalance here, but we had a small wedding haha)
This is a great point that making a plan to stay friends can work and morph a relationship. It’s not the same but nothing stays the same.
I can’t help but notice you didn’t say anything about how your potential new partner might feel about this. Perhaps you didn’t think it was relevant, but that’s a huge blind spot if you haven’t considered it.
Yeah, I’ve thought about it. Things would definitely have to change before I started dating. I think what I didn’t consider is how long it might take to make those changes. That I couldn’t just jump into it now that I’m feeling ready.
Or try having a relationship with your friend? A relationship is basically a good friendship with shared responsibilities (and sex, if you’ve got the time). You’re almost there already.
Who doesn’t have the time?
Ace people, I would assume, but don’t want to put words in anyone’s mouth.
I don’t think it’s a matter of time though. 2 minutes tops.
